| Thomas More's office | |
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+8Elizabeth Barton Mary Tudor Thomas Jack Geoffrey Lonshord Cardinal John Fisher Thomas Cromwell Catherine Parr Thomas More 12 posters |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Thu May 23, 2013 10:27 pm | |
| Thomas followed his movements with his eyes and took a deep breath, shooking his head
I don't know. Anyone had so much power, before. This means...that he has no need Pope's permission anymore. And your niece will be probably his new wife, according with his plans...
He answered, trying to understand if he was instead pleased about his family raising | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Fri May 24, 2013 9:27 pm | |
| Norfolk listened to him and as he noticed Thomas' expression he pursed his lips. He straightened his back while he shook a finger at him.
I know what you think my friend! You will probably think that this is very convenient to me... but let me tell you this: I would sell my wife, I would give up everything to see my niece on the throne, but, God is my witness, no one can tamper with the fundamentals of the true faith!
He wiped his forehead. I don't understand her... he whispered.Always reading, even the Bible! | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Fri May 24, 2013 10:31 pm | |
| Thomas frowned deeply after his last sentence
Anne Boleyn reads the Bible? Seriously?
He asked curiously, rather surprised by such revelation | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sun May 26, 2013 7:12 pm | |
| Norfolk looked up, surprised that he obviously had spoken loudly. He shrugged and grimaced.
Yes, she reads... all the time!
He plopped down on a chair.
Why should women read? It is boring, even for men! What a waste of time, don't you think? Tell me honestly, Thomas, would you like it if Alice read? He looked at him curiously. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sun May 26, 2013 10:47 pm | |
| Thomas looked at him curiously. Then laughed and shook his head
Your Grace...my wife wants even to write, and she already reads many books. I think women should have the same instruction of men, including going at University. My daughters read and I'm very proud of them...
He answered sincerely, noticing his astonished face | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Mon May 27, 2013 9:37 pm | |
| He looked at Thomas in disbelief, then laughed along with him.
Ahh I should have known, of course. Your house is a stronghold of learning, while mine is an army unit! He laughed loudly and hit his knee.
My wife writes too, you know, many letters to complain about everything I say and do. I must say that I prefer her writings over her sharp tongue, though.
He thought about Thomas' words about his children and nodded. I imagine that you are proud on them, as I am on my children. My boys will be good peers and soldiers even though my eldest son also likes to write poems. he spoke the last word with a face like he smelled something dirty. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Mon May 27, 2013 10:42 pm | |
| Thomas sighed and closed a book on his desk
You should open your mind, Your Grace. Old times are gone. And in spite of I'm not a supporter of...progress, I have to admit that women's instruction is a good thing. Don't understimate them, my lord...
He added with an amused smile on his face | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Tue May 28, 2013 9:08 pm | |
| Norfolk scratched his chin. Old times are gone, yes. Spoken about old times, the Cardinal is put in prison and I would like to forget his existence, but soon he will demand a trial or even worse, a word with the king. Does Henry ever mention him to you? I would sleep much better if I knew for sure that he will not speak with Henry in private and try to increase his influence on him once more.
He looked up and added strongly. I agree with you that women need education. And I definetely do not underestimate them, I assure you! I do think they need a strong hand, they are unpredictable. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Tue May 28, 2013 10:20 pm | |
| Thomas sighed deeply after his words and shook his head
No, Your Grace...the King never talked with me about the Cardinal, recently. But surely he still has contacts with court, so I think he'll try to talk with the King, now or later. But even if he did, why are you worried, Your Grace? I barely have still influence on him, so even less has the Cardinal...
He answered, considering that this event could happen in every moment | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:21 pm | |
| I don't worry! he said quickly and turned around to watch the view outside the window to hide his feelings.. ... not about Wolsey, I mean! he frowned, shook his head to make his fears about the cardinal disappear and turned to Thomas again.
I do worry though that no one seems to influence the king, he is capricious. And why is that man constantly in his neighborhood, that elusive son of a blacksmith? Another workaholic of humble origins, wandering around the king! he came closer to Thomas desk.
... and just as cunning as his former master! | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:52 pm | |
| Thomas looked perplexed at him for a little while. Then he cleared his throath
Are you talking about Master Cromwell, Your Grace?
He asked curiously, not fully understanding what he was referring about | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:23 pm | |
| Yes, I talk about Cromwell! He is rising, mark my words. And unlike Wolsey, he is not only a man of diplomacy but he also fought with his bare hands. I don't trust him and neither should Henry!
He exhaled and smiled faintly. Well, as long as you are the Lord Chancellor, I don't worry too much. I know Henry is not as close to you as he used to be, but he still trusts you and admires you. Your approval is very important to him. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:16 pm | |
| Thomas listened him carefully and then sighed deeply
Yes...he is not so close to me as before, it's true. But I want to use my task as Chancellor for Kingdom's sake. And...about Cromwell, many people dislike him at court, because of his origins. But this not the point. The point, and the real danger, is that he can turn the King towards the false faith. I heard...he reads Luther's books...
He added with a bit of sadness in his voice | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sat Jun 08, 2013 3:02 pm | |
| Norfolk stared at his serious sad face and sighed. I know you do, Thomas. He should be more grateful to you, you have so many weight on your shoulders!
He listened to his words about Cromwell and bited his lips. I can't see why this man should earn more authority, he is a nobody! he spoke angrily and shook his head as Thomas continued. I suspected him to do so! He will do everything to get more power, just like Wolsey! But accepting the false faith is quite threatening, we will have to watch him carefully, Thomas. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:50 pm | |
| Thomas nodded and leaned his hands together on his desk
I know we should, Your Grace. But the false faith is now accepted by your niece Anne too. I'm sure she just wants to please the King. But what will happen to this country if catholic faith will be destroyed? Cromwell has lutheran friends at Oxford and elesewhere. There are many more people like him we should watch carefully, Your Grace...
He added and let out a deep sigh | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:28 pm | |
| Thomas talked about his niece and Norfolk groaned. That stubborn girl thinks she knows best, she has strange ideas and I even suspect her to encourage the king to leave the true faith! And her father... is the same. I want her on the throne but I don't agree with her wild ideas! Reading the Bible in English, tss, the Bible should be read by the clergymen, in decent Latin and we only have to listen.
He shook his head heavily and pointed at Thomas. You need to act strictly, Thomas. Wolsey was too kind to those heretics. Burn them, burn them all and the others will return to the true faith soon enough. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:55 pm | |
| Thomas took a deep breath and nodded thoughtfully
I already burned many, Your Grace. But they are everywhere. At court, in towns, in Universites...even in our churchs. Everywere. I should burn half population of England. And I can't, of course...
He admitted with a deep sigh and looked at him | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:22 pm | |
| Norfolk squinted and started to pace again, restless.
No, of course you can't... though burning more of them would probably scare them off more. Agggg if only there were more nobles who could make him see that he is straying, but like his father he decreased many of their titles and power. He becomes more and more autonomous, with only sycophants around him. I also want to help him in his divorce matter, but turning away from the true faith is not the solution! And how will France and Spain react as they find out? | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Sun Jun 16, 2013 11:08 pm | |
| Thomas couldn't avoid to shrug after his question. He looked at his papers
I'm not sure...but I think that Cromwell is taking care of such matters. I even heard that he has a new pupil. A certain...Cranmer. Have you already heard about him?
He asked, turning his eyes to him | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Mon Jun 17, 2013 10:21 pm | |
| Norfolk turned on his heels as Thomas mentioned Cranmer and looked sharply at him.
Cranmer? You mean Cranmer, the Cambridge don who assisted Wolsey in 1527 as he consulted university experts to decide on the annullment? He is a strange man with strange ideas, Thomas. I don't think we have reason to rejoice this new pupil! | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:17 pm | |
| Thomas nodded and lowered his voice like if someone could hear him
And...I also heard that this Cranmer is at court with his wife! Can you understand? A clergyman...married? | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:39 pm | |
| Norfolk came closer, holding his breath.
Really? I don't like this, not at all! He clucked his tongue and looked at Thomas, frowning. He is even stranger than I thought. I hope he won't get close to Henry with his radical ideas, Thomas, it would not serve you, too.
He shook his head slowly.
If only the Pope was willingly to grant the annulment, besides fear of the Emperor I can't see any reason why he should not yield. he sighed deeply. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:51 pm | |
| Thomas looked at him and shook his head
The Pope will never grant him the annullment, Your Grace. The marriage with Katherine is valid, and the King knows that, deeply inside him. Just...his mind his poisoned by Cromwell and other heretics...
He sighed and raised his eyes to ceiling for a little while | |
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Thomas Howard 3rd Duke of Norfolk
Posts : 681 Join date : 2012-02-02 Age : 28 Location : Norfolk
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Fri Jul 05, 2013 9:36 pm | |
| He shakes his head in disagreement and sniffs. Of course I respect him, but he has granted annullments before, for less reasons. And lack of marital duty to not give him a son is a plausible reason to divorce, Thomas. She can not give him his male heir... and he was not supposed to marry his brothers wife in the first place. | |
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Thomas More Courtier
Posts : 815 Join date : 2011-12-06 Location : England
| Subject: Re: Thomas More's office Fri Jul 05, 2013 10:26 pm | |
| Thomas took a breath and looked at him with firm glance
Your Grace...you know perfectly that marriage between Princess Catalina and Prince Arthur was invalid. They were nothing else than children, that time. And marriage was never consummated. This means that in God's eyes, our Queen is King Henry's legitimate wife. I'm sorry talking so openly against your niece's interest. But you know my opinions, my lord...
He added with a deep sigh and turned his eyes towards his papers again | |
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